Question on loco motors

[Mathew]

Ive been working on isolating the motor(s) for installing dcc and cleaning the contacts and have a few questions. Im working on Athearn Blue Box locos. Im using these as "learning locos" but I dont want to destroy them.

1. How do you tell the positve from the negitive side of the motor?

2. Will installing the motor upside down or opposite the way you took it out affect it? Im not sure how to explain this one. For example. You have the loco facing you with the cab to your left (engineer side facing you) you take the motor out and, not paying attention, turned it 360 and put it back in opposite how you took it out.

3. If you reversed any of the above how or will it affect DCC?

4. Is it even possible to do what I think I did? Everything went back together ok, im just worried about frying my decoders (DH123)

[dtinut]

As long as motor is isolated from chassis, should not fry a decoder, even if you mess uo the red/black power input wires and the orange/gray motor control wires.

Switching them only reverses the loco's direction, and can be corrected either by swapping the wires around or in setting up the decoder.

Brian

[Randy Earle]

I always figured the top brush was hot and the bottom ground.

[Mathew]

Thanks for the feedback.

[Randy Earle]

If you mount the coupler with a #5 box on most BB Athearns the coupler becomes insulated.

[spike]

I have found that the factory mounting tab is too high. They also are in the way if you have plows covering the slots. I build up styrene blocks under the walkways.

[CIOR]

When it came to Athearn BB here is what I use to do.

I would take the trucks off, and solder wires onto each side, and then paint the frame under the motor black and put a thin layer of electrical tape once dried. Then I soldered on wires to the motor, and put it all back in place. Now I would test tie the motor to the decoder, wrap each wire with a tad bit of tape to make sure you don't short, and test on my test track.

Once I had the motor and lights all working as I wanted, I removed the tape, and put heatshrink tube on and soldered it all up. Put the shell on and away you go.

Also, remove the decoder from the harness until you test and remove again when you solder. Long story, but you run a risk of pinching, burning, possibly messing up the decoder and its just a common practice I did.

Its not tough, just take your time and have fun.

[Raeder]

The motor installation I have seen on most, if not all, Athearn Blue Box locos made it impossible to install the motor in backwards, or upside-down. The motor wouldn't fit, and if it did, it would have nothing to hold it in place.

I second the taping idea recommended above, you need something physically keeping that bottom motor strip from contacting the frame at that point.

Blue Box loco motors may not sound or run as good as some of the newer stuff, but the reason that they are still around is because they are durable. D-U-R-A-B-L-E. Short of beating one with a hammer, you're not likely to hurt it much. The amount of power required to destroy one faster than a human could react is not present in your DCC system long enough to do the job, and if it is, you've got a bigger problem! If you hook it in backwards, it will run backwards. Your entire unit will roll backwards while the headlights are on, and it is fairly obvious when that happens! Swap some wires around, and re-test.

Digitrax decoders are fairly forgiving of an overload, they will start to heat up until they are burning hot, then poof! The last time I blew a decoder, i pushed it too hard with a ground-to-motor short I didn't know about, and the decoder heated up to the point where it would burn me, but it lasted for about five minutes before it went. Digitrax decoders don't get that hot in normal operation, so if you can't comfotably hold the decoder after it has been running for a minute, or five, or ten, or whatever, you've got another problem.

To solder the wires on in the correct orientation, so that the motor drives the loco in the forward direction, solder the orange wire to the top strip and the gray wire to the bottom. A sun rise always has orange in it, and the sun rises up!

Hope this helps!

Kevin

[Mathew]

Thanks guys! I managed to get the power connections solderd on tonight but I have yet to figure out the light. The loco only has the one light and there three wires. Blue - common and then a yellow and white one. Im working off of PDF's Ive gotton online about the DH123D but Ive got DH123 so I assume there about the same. I got an idea on using another light that Im goin to try that actually has wires to connect to instead of just a contact point. This has been a big project of firsts for me. Just to name a few things Ive done the last two days -

Stripped 4 shells for new paint (waitin for finances for paint)
Completley broke down a loco into a pile of parts and reassembled (tested and working)
In the process of installing a DCC decoder (first time soldering as well)
Then I need to figure out how to program the decoder! Ive got a MRC Prodigy express but thats a learning experience too!!

When all this is said and done I will have completly redone 4 locos for my private fleet. Thats a busy two days

[CIOR]

Mathew,
The light issue is simple.
Buy a grain of wheat bulb (made by MANY companies). I use the ModelPower bulbs in the walthers cat. Use the 14v bulb, it is all ready to go for you.
You will notice that the Blue/White/Yellow wires are all lighting. The Blue wire is the common, so if you wanted front and reverse headlights, that means that one wire from each bulb would go to the blue, then the white and yellow wires power the forward and reverse lights, meaning the yellow wire goes to one bulb and the white wire goes to the other.

If you want you can use grain or rice bulbs and put them in the little holes for the headlamps. This is what mose people do.

Now, back to the motor.
I forgot to mention that I pull the bottom motor clip off and then you will see 2 little tabs that push down to make contact with the frame. I take flush cut nips and cut them off or you can bend them back up. I then soldered a thin wire in there and reattached the clip in place.

I always removed the clips top and bottom when I soldered, because I would clean (sand and wipe them) and then solder onto them.

[Mathew]

Well, Im still having trouble. Im about 90% sure ive got my power connections right, and Ive tried diffrent variations with the light. Im unable to get the loco to do anything. The light comes on but I cant control it. I tried all 3 decoders thinking maybe one was bad. Im assuming it may be something with the programming but I dont know how to do that.

[CIOR]

go to program, set the CV08 to 08 and enter. This will factory reset the decoder.
Then do it AGAIN. I always do the reset atleast 3 times.
Now try address 3 again.

If you have light control, then you have the truck to decoder part correct. The only issue now is making sure you have the RED and BLACK wires to the motor. It won't matter which wire goes to what, that will only matter what direction it moves when under power.

I always tested the engine in DC before I started conversion because I found a few Athearn BB's motors that weren't up to it!

[Mathew]

SUCCESS!!!! Its working. I have officially done my first decoder install. Its a little sloppy, not quit picture perfect and needs a little fine tuning, but hey, I did it myself and it works!!

Thanks for all the help everyone!!

[CIOR]

Mathew, another tidbit.
If you have troubles after the install, then use a VOM (Volt Meter) and place the engine on the track, turn the throttle to 50 and take a voltage measurement on the motor leads. If nothing, then unhook the motor and test he bare wires.
I've seen a "DEAD" motor suck down the voltage...LOL

[Mathew]

It seems to work fine, just need to figure out how to adjust it so it starts off at a slower speed. Depending on what speed step Im using / playing with, the lcd on the controller shows the loco won't move until about 8-10mph or more.

[CIOR]

Go pull the CV table off the net, google it there are a few sources.

Then play around.

Just remember, if you mess it up....

CV08=08...that is factory reset to default and address will be 03 again.