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Post by jakeloyst on Jul 13, 2014 10:07:59 GMT -5
I am looking for info and photos of the long roof wide winter hatch used on some of CNs F-units in plow service. I have some showing the side view, but only summer shots, and it looks like parts of the hatch are removed leaving it totally open, Does anyone have winter shots in service showing the unit , lol, not in a cloud of snow, or by chance an overhead shot or any dimensions.. thanks jake
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Post by iomalley on Jul 13, 2014 10:25:43 GMT -5
Hi Jake; They were just hinged closed during the winter. There are horizontal 'doors' that cover the angled portion of the roof 'contraption' You can see the six hinges on 9178 flipped down for winter. You can just see the slightly warped door flipped onto the roof of 9166 in 'summer' mode.  Bruce Mercer photo  Bill Grandin photo And the second shot of 9178 shows the back one closed, but the front one is probably missing. One of my father's spring tasks, when he worked at the London RH, was to patrol Southern Ontario to fetch hatch lids, rerailers, and pretty much anything else that worked loose from locos over the winter.  Unknown photographer Also note the plexiglas applied over the numberboards. This was done because the snow would actually push them into the nose. The GP9s in plow service were mod'd as well. Here's a roof shot showing the stacks thru...  |
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Post by jakeloyst on Jul 13, 2014 13:35:42 GMT -5
Thank you a millions, exactly the photos I needed. another question I have now, I the boxes along the side of the unit, I;m guess they covered the various openings and were closed on 3 sides and just open to the bottom for the air flow then?
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dekon
Staff Member
Posts: 634
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Post by dekon on Jul 13, 2014 19:04:06 GMT -5
Those are some cool looking F units.
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Post by tjmfishing on Jul 13, 2014 20:50:12 GMT -5
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Post by jakeloyst on Jul 13, 2014 21:41:01 GMT -5
so much for the light fluffy flakes!
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Post by iomalley on Jul 14, 2014 10:25:36 GMT -5
Yes, those side covers were open at the bottom, but they still plugged up with snow, it just took a little longer to happen. The reason the F7s were favourable plow units was due to the fact that shop crews didn't have to dig the crew out at the end of the shift. The running crew was trapped in the GP9s until they could be dug out!
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Post by jakeloyst on Jul 14, 2014 19:47:28 GMT -5
I can believe that! The ride in the F7 must be quite the rock and roll, with no eyes. Wonder if anyone thought to leave the side panel open on the bottom and the back edge?  with the snowing swirling, it might not have been able to stick inside and swirl back to dump on the geeps, lol. Thanks for the info, project in the making! |
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Post by tjmfishing on Jul 14, 2014 20:10:02 GMT -5
Dangerous job regardless, but I am more referring to the guys in the plow with no control over the train and an airhorn. I know of one crew who came upon a large drift on the Chandler Sub late one night and were thrown clear through the front windsheilds.
Then there is always the video of the train up in Southern Ontario with a plow-RS-18-GP-RS-18 that kept trying to ram through a filled in cut and on the last go ended up sending the plow and lead locomotive 30 or 40 feet straight up into the air.
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Post by jakeloyst on Jul 14, 2014 20:44:30 GMT -5
true enough, not sure which one I would choose, riding in back pushing, not really being able to see anything, or upfront, seeing whats coming, but not having much control over it! Hard Choice!
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Post by iomalley on Jul 14, 2014 22:05:37 GMT -5
Yeah I remember that film. From what I gather it was taken by an old lady somewhere near 'Mustard Cut' on the Goderich Sub. It tossed those diesels out of the hole like toys! There's radio communication between the road foreman (in the plow) and the hogger running the locos. I think there's a helper in the plow as well, a brakeman in the engine too, and of course the conductor in the van. Photo essay from the King.... www.gregmcdonnell.com/being-there/ |
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Post by tjmfishing on Jul 15, 2014 21:13:43 GMT -5
Man I sure wish the clip of that was still on the internet. It was linked on a Facebook group one day. I watched it once, sat down the following night to save the video off of youtube and it had already been pulled...
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Post by T on Jul 16, 2014 7:32:34 GMT -5
Hello Gentlemen,
I always was curious about the large box on top and the boxes on CN No. 9178 and CN No.9166. A friend said that they were rebuilt and had their horsepower upgraded to GP 20,GP38-2 status and use for road service. I told him that they were possibly for Snow Service and no upgrade. He said, rather insisted they were not. Could someone explain the boxes/coverings and their purpose?
Tom
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Post by iomalley on Jul 16, 2014 7:46:57 GMT -5
Sure, firstly your friend was way off, you are right. These F7s were rebuilt in the early 70's before 'dash 2' was in fashion, and a good 'ol 567 beats under that hood. The roof hoods kept snow and ice out of the fans, and the idea was to allow the warmer air to be recirculated in through the side grilles while the engine sat idling, basically in theory a 'deicing' was to occur while stationary. Not sure if that was ever achieved though. All bets were off when the unit was moving in plow service, but the hood still kept the bulk of snow and ice from plugging or damaging the fans. The snow hoods on the GP9s and RS18s seemed to work better in principal, they appear better designed anyway... www.cnrphotos.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=16552www.cnrphotos.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=66365They also tried a side induction grille on SW1200s for snow purposes... www.cnrphotos.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=79473CN always had the luxury of taxpayer dollars to try out these somewhat 'questionable' endeavours. Even the snowshields on SD40s, GP38-2s and GP40s did little to stop the generator room from filling up with snow. They carried on with them cuz you and I were footing the bill, and someone in the MP division won a design award for it. Every diesel CN built or ordered was a Cadillac until it went private in 1995....That's why I model them, $100 model with $50 worth of detail parts on it...  |
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Post by jakeloyst on Jul 16, 2014 20:15:17 GMT -5
so now I have another question, I assumed the from grill was a winter cover of some sort, but I don't have a close photo, is there door that close over the center section and it draws air only from the sides?
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Post by tjmfishing on Jul 16, 2014 20:35:12 GMT -5
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Post by tjmfishing on Jul 21, 2014 6:17:47 GMT -5
Apparently the clip of that plow train going airborne is back up. You guys should watch this.
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Post by iomalley on Jul 21, 2014 8:49:01 GMT -5
Yeah I think my dad mentioned that (at least with the old S switchers) they used to disconnect the air cylinder to the shutters to keep them open all winter, because any ice accumulated on them would damage the vanes when they closed, bending or breaking them. So the solution was to drape a tarp over the opening, but the problem was that the running crews were responsible for its control, because the shutters were thermostat controlled. The onus was left on a 'non-mechanical' individual. If a crew left at the end of their shift with the tarps down, and the engine reached hot temperature idling, automatically shuts down, no ones' around to hear the alarm bell, and when the crew comes back Monday morning the locomotive froze and cracked the block. The tarps were not a solution for plowing, as the engine needs the air flow and the closed tarp doesn't allow any to pass. |
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Post by CP_8530 on Jul 22, 2014 13:46:35 GMT -5
CP encountered this issue on their SW1200RS units in road service: Snow would get in to the shutter area, the thermostat would eventually close them, the heat would melt the snow into water, the shutters eventually would open, the water would turn to ice, and then the shutters would be frozen. Rather than fancy winterization hatches or tarps, CP's solution was removable plywood "snow shields" applied before every winter. IIRC, CN had something similar on some of their 1900-series GMD1's too. www.mountainrailway.com/Roster%20Archive/CP%208100/CP%208151-1.jpg |
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Post by tjmfishing on Jul 22, 2014 13:56:07 GMT -5
CP encountered this issue on their SW1200RS units in road service: Snow would get in to the shutter area, the thermostat would eventually close them, the heat would melt the snow into water, the shutters eventually would open, the water would turn to ice, and then the shutters would be frozen. Rather than fancy winterization hatches or tarps, CP's solution was removable plywood "snow shields" applied before every winter. IIRC, CN had something similar on some of their 1900-series GMD1's too. www.mountainrailway.com/Roster%20Archive/CP%208100/CP%208151-1.jpgI assumed you meant over the rad not the handrails. Neat how they painted them and everything. Would have been neat if you guys had have offered some of your GMD-1's with removable shields eh Dan. |
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with the snowing swirling, it might not have been able to stick inside and swirl back to dump on the geeps, lol. Thanks for the info, project in the making!
